Meanwhile in El Salvador, it turns out enforcing law and order and locking up criminals, i.e. "being cruel", is a popular and effective way to run a country. Nayib Bukele, president of El Salvador, here to discuss how he has built on the progress of saving lives in addition to tourism, public works and infrastructure.

The main argument against the punitive approach to crime is that locking them up just makes the criminals someone else's problem instead of helping criminals to actually leave behind their life of crime. That's if the anti-incarceration movement in its various forms isn't being honest about wanting to keep criminals around as political tools.